Alright, here me out.
If you’re not already familiar with the YouTube show Hot Ones, you should go google it. In fact, go watch a few episodes. Hell, watch a couple of seasons. It’s been going for a decade now, and it’s incredible. I’ll wait for you to get caught up.
Not feeling googly? Okay. Well, in short, Hot Ones is an interview show with a unique gimmick: across each interview, host Sean Evans and the guests eat through ten progressively hotter hot wings— starting with fairly mild store-bought sauces and gradually working toward a custom-made magma in a bottle known as “The Last Dab.” The show’s appeal doesn’t just lie in watching famous people in pain though; rather, as the spice kicks in, the guests tend to get a little sillier and more spontaneous. We see very human sides of these celebrities, and I’ve noticed that this isn’t just because of the capsaicin.
While Evans is a trained journalist, his highly casual interview style has a surprising amount in common with a style of counseling known as “person-centered therapy” or “client-centered therapy” developed by therapist Carl Rogers and introduced to mainstream counseling in the 1950s. Person-centered therapy focuses on three core tenets which Evans embodies beautifully:
Congruence
Rogers argued that, to create a safe environment for clients to share their feelings, therapists need to be honest and open about their own thoughts. This is best done through simple reactive statements as a client shares (“Oh wow, that’s heavy,” “I’m happy you’re making such progress on that goal,” etc.). In doing this, the therapist is gently modeling openness and vulnerability for the client while also building trust.
Now, there are limits to this. A therapist shouldn’t introduce their own outside stressors into the session. A fight at home, an annoying client from earlier in the day, a pressing deadline on certification renewal materials— these kinds of burdens on the therapist don’t need to be named explicitly in a visit. “I’m a little tired today” is all the explanation these kinds of things need. Similarly, if the therapist begins to think judgmentally toward a client, well… maybe this is a good segue into the next one.
Unconditional Positive Regard
Rogerian therapists should always think of their clients positively— give them the benefit of the doubt, leave them room to explore their motivations, etc. The goal here is for the client not to even worry about the therapist’s approval or disapproval during a session, and as a consequence, the client is free to focus on whether they themselves approve of their decisions and actions. Additionally, unconditional positive regard enables the client to explore past situations where their self-worth was compromised without fear of it being again compromised in session due to sharing the experience. The session is safe because the therapist accepts the whole person with all their experiences.
Of course, as with congruence, there are limits here too. Unconditional positive regard doesn’t mean the client can do no wrong; it means the therapist is always rooting for the client to succeed and that the therapist will not demean the client because of a mistake. A therapist can still acknowledge setbacks and screwups without dismissing the patient. The therapist doesn’t seek to judge so much as to understand, and speaking of understanding, core tenet #3 is…
Accurate Empathic Understanding
A therapist should do their best to position themselves within the client’s frame of reference and understanding of the world. This empathic connection will allow the therapist to better communicate with the client and help them explore their experiences and emotions. While this one may seem like a no-brainer today, keep in mind that Rogers was writing in the 1950s, when some of these concepts weren’t so readily discussed.
So there you have it: congruence, unconditional positive regard, accurate empathic understanding. These three are the backbone of Rogerian therapy, but I’d argue they’re also the secret sauce that makes Hot Ones so compelling.
Sean Evans makes a point of being utterly fascinated by every guest; he and his team take deep dives into the guests’ social media profiles, read their books, and dig up TV appearances and quotes from decades in the past. Even in the rare case where Evans brings up something embarrassing, the guest is always in on the joke (unconditional positive regard). Evans never demeans his guests as they struggle with spice; he cheers them on and encourages them, and he acknowledges his own difficulty (congruence). As a journalist, he wants to keep them talking, and by sharing the hot wing journey, he establishes himself as a trusted companion. By the end of every interview, Evans and the guest are hugging and laughing because they’ve just been through something intense together (accurate empathic understanding).
Remarkably, I can only identify one instance where Evans hit the limits of his empathy, congruence, and positivity. Across 21 seasons, Evans himself has gotten spicy with a guest one time— when DJ Khaled infamously made a fool of himself in the finale of season 1 and Evans got a little dismissive of the increasingly irate and boastful Khaled. However, even in this bizarre episode, the guest was allowed to stay and talk.
So, is Sean Evans covertly a Rogerian therapist? No, of course not. But he’s hit upon an important lesson: the characteristics of a good client-centered therapist (congruence, unconditional positive regard, and accurate empathic understanding) can also make a very compelling interviewer.
Of course, the spice-induced silliness doesn’t hurt either.